Talk:Other Lancaster Positions

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I'm creating a discussion page for this because there seems to be a fair amount of fighting over several listings here, and problems should be worked out before making edits, and because the page in general has some organizational problems

Issues to resolve:

  • Definition of a passed down item versus a position
  • Whether there is a proper procedure to create a new position
  • What do do with dead positions
  • Whether a dead position should be listed on this page if it was only passed once
  • Whether the list should be divided or organized by session

Please discuss, we don't want to make major edits without agreement among users.

Creation of New Positions

Alright so I've just taken the trouble to organize the list of positions so here's how to add a new one

1. Add an entry on this page. Keep in mind whether what you are adding is a true position or a passed-down item. If you're confused about the difference, refer to Position. Put it in the right section accordingly.

2. Add it to the list on the page Position and link it here.

Recent Edits to Positions Pages

Due to the amount of shameless egotism and the tendency of positions to go defunct, I've moved everything that hasn't been around at least five years to Memories. At least a dozen new "positions" or "relics" have been created over the past four years! Few if any of these came about accidentally or organically, and some of them (e.g. Rascal) promote things that do not need to be encouraged.

Dutchman (talk) 00:48, 7 January 2016 (EST)

Perhaps we should make separate pages for "Pending Positions" and "Defunct Positions" so that other pages don't get too cluttered? I agree that there should be a certain amount of time that positions/relics should have existed, but I feel like the entries clutter the Memories page.

There are some positions (Friend, Rascal, Coconuts) that are official positions and in no way disputed. The original holders have all aged out and I think it is only fair to put them as official. They all have permanent relics that have been around for a long time. And I don't understand why everyone is against Rascal. Also the different between a passed down item and a position is simple. A position is something that comes with responsibilty (i.e. promote tradition, lead something, take pictures, run blammo). -User:Annievail9

Original holders aging out is insufficient, because a large number of positions (such as the grail positions)were created by a nomore. I am against Rascal because "promoting sketchiness" has had a habit of escalating to the point where consent was either not given or was made under social duress. Dutchman (talk) 14:33, 18 January 2016 (EST)

I mean the people who were originally there for the creation of the position have all aged out. Also, if you're against rascal that's like being against fiend because they have the same job, only rascal is less generalized. Rascal and satan try their best to promote a safe environment where consent is key. It's been emphasized heavily in their speeches. -User:Annievail9

I think the same or a similar rule for defunct positions could be followed, as to whether it gets listed on the positions page or in memories. If a position was only around for two years, I don't think it really counts. Also, Annie, since those positions are definitely sticking around, just let them be for another few years to prove it. It's not a big deal how they're listed on here, there needs to be some kind of rule. -User:Ariel

Ex machina

This debate is both ageless and tiresome, but here are my thoughts on it:

  1. When I created the Memories pages, they were intended to be the rug under which all the clutter was swept. They still serve this purpose. Most of the entries in the Memories pages are of interest to nobody except the people who wrote them or who are their subjects; they can't get more cluttered because they are clutter. They could be deleted and only a handful of people would be but fractionally disappointed. Hopefully the truth in this is self-evident.
  2. The primary mechanism by which new positions have been created, at least since when I attended CTY (which was 8-12 years ago... wow...), was that a person wanted to be remembered by more than the people who knew them. Their friends, their memories, and their friends' memories weren't enough for them; they needed history and permanence. This is a double-edged sword, because traditions are very important to the cultural fabric of CTY, but trying to shape them by force is not a positive way to create them (just ask anybody who attended CTY during any year when the site admin forced a change in traditions).
  3. RealCTY's goal is to help people remember—but it is absolutely not to make people remember. It's not meant as a depository for everyone's every memory, just like Wikipedia isn't a depository for everyone's life. But people want to use it for that, so we have the Memories pages for it. When you consider adding positions to the positions page, or giving them their own articles, you should consider not whether you (or anyone) wants that position to be remembered, but rather, whether it is remembered. I have no idea what is or isn't remembered anymore, but I can still say that using RealCTY to prop up new traditions or ingrain new institutional memories is detrimental to the whole community, including not only this websites but also the students, staff (whose behavior is sometimes very analogous), and the summer programs. I can't judge your choices; I just want to encourage everyone to try to evaluate things in this way.

Good luck!

--Max W. (talk)